K11 Owners Group

93 K11 RS

I just heard about this, have yet to get my hands on the article (by Paul Glaze) in the February issue of BMW ON magazine. The article warns that the new blend of Ethanol (Alcohol) softens the rubber mounting cushion, otherwise know as a vibration dampener, for the in tank fuel pump. The result is a "black goo", which migrates and clogs fuel injectors. This can be very costly if not dealt with...the fix is to replace the dampener with a new part.

The new fuel mixture is just reaching major name fuel stations. Anyone with 1st hand experience with this fuel issue?

carp · Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 5:40 pm Post subject:

I have been running a 10% ethanol blend in my 86 K75 for 10 years with over 50,000 miles. I have replaced the fuel filter but am still on the original pump and gasket. After seeing that article I am wondering if I should replace it or figure if its lasted this long it may last a lot longer??? Originally in MN they put on the pump how much ethanol was in it. Except for non oxygenated premium and diesel, I think there is ethanol in all the gas sold in MN.

BobZ(IL) · Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 7:02 pm Post subject:

Illinois has had 10% ethanol in all grades for several years. 60k on my K with no problems. I'm not aware of a new blend in ILL.
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drmalacarne · Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 8:34 pm Post subject:

Here in Brazil we have a constant 25% of ethanol in the gas in every fuel pump, by a federal law.
Every motorcycle and automobile runs this blend, and we don't have much problem with this.
Guilherme.
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endoman100 · Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 8:50 pm Post subject:

No problems with my k1100rs but I do use 92% octane. In my mind It seems to get better gas mileage. about 50mpg or maybe a little less.
52 miles 1.2 gal to top off the fuel tank after round trip to work.
constant.everytime weather I do 80 or 90 mph Cool

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Scott_Anderson · Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 9:04 pm Post subject:

Short of the weight of the RS compared to the LT, is there any other reason why the RS's seem to get better mpg's than the LT's?????

I rode J.O.'s new RS 2up w/luggage and got over 50mpg. I cant' seem to get over 45 1up wo/luggage on either LT.
Didn't matter what fuel I used, 87 octane w/o ethanol or 92 octane w/o ethanol.

I'm planning on a complete T.B. sync this spring for both bikes and see if that makes a difference or not.
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carp · Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 9:14 pm Post subject: Paul Glaves Article on Ethanol

http://www.bmwmoa.org/bike/tech/general_tech/benchwrenching_questions_and_answers_with_paul

Jim · Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:47 am Post subject:

and here's the text:

"Q: I keep encountering more and more stations that have 10% ethanol added to the fuel. Can I use this in my BMW motorcycle?

A: In many places, ethanol in fuel is almost unavoidable. Some states—Kansas comes to mind—have eliminated the requirement that it be announced with a sign at the pump. So it is hard to know if it is there or not.

Now for the bad news: If you have an Airhead, the ethanol will destroy your OEM fuel floats in short order. It dissolves the lacquer finish on the floats. The floats then absorb fuel and get heavy. Then they sink, causing a high fuel level or causing the bowls to overflow fuel all over your boots. Bing has an "alcohol resistant" float setup that doesn't dissolve, but doesn't meter the fuel level as well either. OEM fuel hoses soften and break down. Bing sells alcohol resistant fuel line, too.

Classic K bikes (K1100, K100, and K75) have a rubber mounting cushion called a “vibration damper” that holds the fuel pump in place. Alcohol attacks this particular rubber piece and soon turns it into a thick, black goo! After a while the goo gets literally sucked into the fuel pump, ruining the fuel pump; possibly into the injectors too. The fuel line seems to be OK. (Note to BMW: there is no excuse for not changing the rubber composition of this piece so it resists alcohol.) On our K75s, I check this piece at least twice a year and replace it if it has softened before it turns completely to goo and ruins things.

I haven't discovered any real mechanical issues with the Oilheads caused by alcohol in the fuel except if the bike is prone to a lean surge the alcohol (having less energy per squirt) may make the surging and rough running worse. If yours happens to run on the rich side this is generally not noticeable.

I think the following from my K75/K100 Haynes Manual is instructive:

"Owners of machines used in the United States should note that pure gasoline only is recommended—fuels containing a percentage of alcohol must not be used since alcohol will cause corrosion in aluminium, brass, rubber, and plastic components and can cause severe engine damage, It may also cause bad starting and performance problems such as misfires or erratic idling."

This manual was written in 1988 and I think it somewhat overstates the problems, but is instructive nonetheless."

Paul Glaves, in BMWON BMW Owner's News

I guess I should look at whatever is in the bottom of the tank - I haven't checked it - it is 12 years old. Gas is so crappy now I always keep Stabil and Heet in the tank. I think maybe some of the early formulations may have been more destructive than the stuff we use now.

Also note that Paul's manual was written in '88. I think they worked some of the kinks out of gasoline by the time our K's were built.
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Jim
1997 K1100LTSE 94,000 - still has gremlins!
1995 R100RT Classic 16,650 crashed - repaired!
1992 K75RTP 46,000

"We shall not all die, but we shall all be changed."

rkildu · Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:17 am Post subject:

After reading this in the ON I drained my tank and inspected the fuel pump mount. I could find no sign of any soft black goo on the fuel pump mounting. In fact it felt more like a hard plastic rather than a rubber material.

This is on a 97 K11LT with 63K miles.

Rod
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97 K1100LT HighLine
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endoman100 · Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 6:13 pm Post subject:

Off the grid · Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 7:55 pm Post subject:

Flying Duck · Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 8:51 pm Post subject:

The goo thing DOES happen. Usually to bikes that have sat for a few years. That K100RS I recently ressurected was majorly gooed.
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Jim · Posted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 12:48 am Post subject:

I guess there's actually no possibility that BMW figured at least US bikes - and maybe some others - would have to deal with gasohol and went ahead and changed the the black thing so it wouldn't turn to goo. Maybe it's only a problem in older bikes. I'll check mine when the weather warms up a little more.
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Jim
1997 K1100LTSE 94,000 - still has gremlins!
1995 R100RT Classic 16,650 crashed - repaired!
1992 K75RTP 46,000

"We shall not all die, but we shall all be changed."

endoman100 · Posted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 9:46 pm Post subject:

93 K11 RS · Posted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 2:27 pm Post subject: Fuel economy - RS vs LT

Off the grid · Posted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 5:54 pm Post subject:

I've never gotten over 37mpg on my LT.
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mnb · Posted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 6:14 pm Post subject:

Jim · Posted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 11:37 pm Post subject: gas tank goo

I've never heard the problem mentioned by the tech I go to, or any of the techs I've talked with at the stealers. Probably only a problem with older bikes.
_________________
Jim
1997 K1100LTSE 94,000 - still has gremlins!
1995 R100RT Classic 16,650 crashed - repaired!
1992 K75RTP 46,000

"We shall not all die, but we shall all be changed."

Flying Duck · Posted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 11:59 pm Post subject:

I think Jim may be right that they changed the rubber compound. Back when they started pissing in gas some autos had issues with the rubber diaphram in the fuel pump so it was a poblem known throughout the automotive industry.

Even then, that K100RS I resurrected was an 85. No maintenance history but I'm guessing it was the original fuel pump. Sitting in old nasty gas for years can't be good for any rubber part.
_________________
93 LT (x2)
94 RS
86-97 K75F(K75/100/1100 Frankenbrick)
86 K75C w/paralever, hi perf cams,TURBO!
91 & 92 K75Ss
91 K1
86 custom K100
14 WR250R
IBA #17739 (SS1K, BBG, 50CC)
Buy parts HERE

Mystic Red · Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:07 pm Post subject:

As johnny would say, "ripped from the pages of the BMWMOA forums":