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Flying Duck
PsyKotic Waterfowl
Joined: 27 Jan 2005
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Location: Bumf***, WA
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 Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 3:20 pm Post subject: Obama fans don't seem to be big fans of The Constitution |
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| Quote: | | While 82% of voters who support McCain believe the justices should rule on what is in the Constitution, just 29% of Barack Obama’s supporters agree. Just 11% of McCain supporters say judges should rule based on the judge’s sense of fairness, while nearly half (49%) of Obama supporters agree. |
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/mood_of_america/supreme_court_ratings/supreme_court_update
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Klinker
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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There those damn independent-thinking liberals go again...
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tlp
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Flying Duck
PsyKotic Waterfowl
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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Our system is based upon the concept that the Constitution is the law of the land and that it is judges' role to interpret it, not legislate from the bench.
It is the role of the legislate branch to make law, not the judicial branch. This is why the Constitution provides for an amendment process and a clearly laid out process for establishing laws.
I would much rather have laws drafted by the legislative branch(elected representatives of the people) which provides much more input, viewpoints and open discuussion as provided for in The Constiution than nine politically appointees in a back room. It seems to me that the legislative process is much more open and open-minded than having legislation determined from the bench.
Are you really sure you want to surrender your Constitutional rights to the whims of nine political appointees and their individual/collective concept of "fairness?" 
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Off the grid
Chaotic Good
Joined: 05 Jul 2006
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Location: At the local taco truck waiting for Jo.
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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Lets just ignore what Bush did to the constitution in the last 8 years.
What a benchmark for justice.
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SugarHillCTD
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Off the grid wrote: | Lets just ignore what Bush did to the constitution in the last 8 years.
What a benchmark for justice. |
+1
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Jim
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Off the grid wrote: | Lets just ignore what Bush did to the constitution in the last 8 years.
What a benchmark for justice. |
+1
Which, by the way, he took an oath to uphold. Guess that ratty piece of paper got in his way.
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Klinker
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 28 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Flying Duck wrote: | Our system is based upon the concept that the Constitution is the law of the land and that it is judges' role to interpret it, not legislate from the bench.
It is the role of the legislate branch to make law, not the judicial branch. This is why the Constitution provides for an amendment process and a clearly laid out process for establishing laws.
I would much rather have laws drafted by the legislative branch(elected representatives of the people) which provides much more input, viewpoints and open discuussion as provided for in The Constiution than nine politically appointees in a back room. It seems to me that the legislative process is much more open and open-minded than having legislation determined from the bench.
Are you really sure you want to surrender your Constitutional rights to the whims of nine political appointees and their individual/collective concept of "fairness?" |
Whoa. Thanks for the civics lesson. But my comment had a bit more of a tongue-in-cheek intent. There I go again...
(By the way, Ronny Ray Gun, where are you when we need you? All your party can nominate is Bob Dole, Alfred E Neuman, and a delusional codger that's even older than you were.)
It's always tough to assess polls. Much depends on the questions, the questioners and whether the person answering the questions has supper on the stove and really isn't focused on the interuption.
The whole premise of "(ruling) on what is in the Constitution" is absurd, anyway. The Constitution is a living document intentionally written in subjective terms so that it could be interpreted as to what was understood by (hopefully) wise judges to be fair in the present age. As society evolves (or devolves as may be our current situation) and significant cultural change occurs (civil rights, women's suffrage, abolition of slavery), Congress drafts a Constitutional Amendment and the States ratify it or not. When more subtle changes occur, the Supreme Court rules on the cases they choose to hear (Roe v. Wade). To say "rule on what is in the Constitution" sounds like a typical right-wing attempt to make everything in a grey world "black and white."
In any case, I have serious doubts that many "voters who support McCain" have much of a clue or care about "what is in the Constitution." If they did, they wouldn't be supporting a guy that is so gung-ho about an illegal invasion in Iraq.
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tlp
1994 K1100RS
Only the Reasonists. They believe in an evidence-based world, something called Rationalism. But it's a tiny group, not so influential.
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Jim
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 7:11 pm Post subject: the law of the land... |
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you have a point there, Drake. But as long as the Pres and the Supreme Court are both going to ignore the Constitution - guess what? We're fucked!
I don't think Obama can do any worse than has already been done. I just don't want four more years of what we've already had - this country can't take it. Drill, baby, drill... NOT.
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Off the grid
Chaotic Good
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 7:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I just don't want four more years of what we've already had - this country can't take it. |
Once more because it bears repeating.
| Quote: | | I just don't want four more years of what we've already had - this country can't take it. |
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abreeze
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 17 Jun 2006
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Location: atlanta
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 10:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Quote:
I just don't want four more years of what we've already had - this country can't take it. |
Obama must think the people of this country are stupid. His only stand so far is "Me.... or 4 more years of Bush".
I am still waiting for someone to tell what Obama has done to qualify him as Comander and Chief. Other than state the Obvious above!! Hell, OTG has done that too...a thousand times!!!No one dissagrees!!!
On Bill O'riley: Obama states he is only guilty by association with all the creeps he hangs out with....WTF is that supposed to mean....A church with a racist ideology posted on the Website and he didnt know about the racist rhetoric??? How f--king stupid do you think we are....
Pretty f--king stupid I guess.......
And His energy plan "invest in the future".....what do we do till then....As we dont have the money to invest, and it will take 15 years to see the benifet. Lets not drill and keep giving our money to the sand turds, while gas gets more and more expensive and inflating the economy even more!!!
Not drilling because we wont see any benifet for a 'few' years, Or its a 'gimick'!!
Great, while were waiting for the alternate energy sources to come online we can head off the rising fuel costs and put money into Americans pockets....
Sounds pretty F--king stupid to me... |
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Jim
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| Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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Well, Breeze, what was pretty f_____g stoopid was waiting until the last f_____g minute to do something about the energy situation.
Why do you think that happened? Wouldn't have anything to do with greedy oil companies riding the wave, would it? I bet it did.
We could have jumped on the alternative energy bandwagon 20 or more years ago. We could have solar systems on every roof top that would have paid for themselves many times over - but, guess what? One of the big lobbies on "the Hill" is the energy companies - they're not just your little local utility company anymore.
No one f_____g wanted to save any energy. So, here we are - whining about whether to drill or not. Drilling now won't do us much good - think about your grandchildren's future...
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Jim
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Jim
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| Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 12:53 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Obama must think the people of this country are stupid. |
Apparently a lot of them are!
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Jim
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Klinker
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 28 Aug 2006
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| Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 10:06 am Post subject: |
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| Jim wrote: | | Quote: | | Obama must think the people of this country are stupid. |
Apparently a lot of them are! |
Just those that are buying the load of crap being spewed by the McPain/Hatin' Hate-Talk Express.
This whiny, feigned indignation over the "lipstick on a pig" remark is just the latest Swift Boat tactic. Is their own message so hollow that they can't make a case without fabricating this BS? Apparently so. But I fear that their real intent is to suck in more of the lowest common demominator (yes, the below-average folks), because their votes count just as much as rational people's. You CAN fool some of the people all of the time...
Oh, I expect there are those who would find this point of view arrogant or elitist. Sorry. I'm just scared as hell after the last eight years and I'm sick of idiots deciding who should be our leaders.
No, not all who voted for Dubya' are idiots. Some were selfish.
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tlp
1994 K1100RS
Only the Reasonists. They believe in an evidence-based world, something called Rationalism. But it's a tiny group, not so influential.
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abreeze
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 17 Jun 2006
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| Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 11:02 am Post subject: |
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Jim:
..I agree with you. But we cant have it both ways. And those same companies employ and drive the economy. We simply cannot pull the plug on the economy.
Should Everyone who doesnt want to drill stop driving a car! We cant, I have to get to my job..ect...
Its a tough answer....Were late in the game and the stakes are high.
Terry, I dont know if it was intended as a pointed comment or a catch phrase...The audience reaction seemed pointed IMO...And it is petty, and over played. But thats polotics, and the Obama camp ran crying with the New Yorker Cover too. |
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Klinker
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| Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 11:50 am Post subject: |
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| abreeze wrote: | | ...I dont know if it was intended as a pointed comment or a catch phrase...The audience reaction seemed pointed IMO...And it is petty, and over played. But thats polotics, and the Obama camp ran crying with the New Yorker Cover too. |
There is no comparison. The Obama campaign's response to the New Yorker Cover was just that - a response. And the McCain camp agreed.
| Quote: | The Obama campaign quickly condemned the rendering. Spokesman Bill Burton said in a statement: “The New Yorker may think, as one of their staff explained to us, that their cover is a satirical lampoon of the caricature Sen. Obama's right-wing critics have tried to create. But most readers will see it as tasteless and offensive. And we agree."
McCain spokesman Tucker Bounds quickly e-mailed: “We completely agree with the Obama campaign, it’s tasteless and offensive.” |
The McCain/Palin's reaction to the "lipstick on a pig" remark was a calculated, thinly-veiled attempt to get the media talking about something other than Palin's misleading account of her record. This is a Rove-style tactic and it is intentionally aimed at the ignorant. The Republican strategy is to poke post-rational folks with a stick and get them to the voting booth - enough of them to win the majority. In 1992 the winning James Carvel strategy was "It's the economy, stupid." In 2000 and 2004, Rove's strategy was "Get out and vote for our guy, Mr. Stupid." Enough stupid folks did just that. Meanwhile, the selfish fat-cats all whisper to each other at their thousand-dollar a plate fundraisers "Won't life be grand with this tool in our pocket AND the White House." It worked twice and they're trying it again.
Our problem begins when we can't see the difference between each party and dismiss the malicious methods of the Repubs as just "politics." If at least a majority of us can't recognize integrity versus the lack thereof, I have little optimism for our future.
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tlp
1994 K1100RS
Only the Reasonists. They believe in an evidence-based world, something called Rationalism. But it's a tiny group, not so influential.
- Page Griffin |
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John Clauss
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Joined: 04 Apr 2003
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| Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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I am still wondering what happened to all of the "Family Values" Republicans? I mean come on, one minute its there biggest push, now they are silent. Gee I wonder why?
Not that the Democrats do not have there share of hypocrits, but republicans pointing out how the Democrats want to destroy the Constitution? Really? Seriously?
Hello Pot, meet Kettle!
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