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grant93
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 238
Location: Victoria - Australia
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 Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 4:41 am Post subject: ABS Help Please |
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Gidday,
Ok so when I brought this bike last week the independent bike shop owner said it had a speedo issue and that he didnt really know much about "K" bikes, he tried to fix it but gave up in the end and pushed it aside, and this is where I step into the picture.
Ok so today I have the auto electrician test some plugs and sensors, yes I have power to the rear speedo sensor, he tested the connection near the battery and also I pulled the sensor from the final drive which he tested with a low pulse tester? and all is good there.. GREAT! and so the fault must be up the front end of the housing which I will look into over Easter..
So I then get him to test the front and rear ABS sensors and yes I have power at them also.. GREAT!
BUT when I brought the bike the sensors have been left undone and left hanging loosely and I was handed a small container with some nuts, bolts and small thin what look like spacers that match the shape of the sensor where it goes through the housing on the bike.. Hope I am making some sense?
Is there any special way that these need to go back in?
Do I need to use them at all?
As I do not have a manual and my bike is a 10th month 1993, is my bike ABS 1 or ABS 2?
Now for the dumb question.. what actually does the "sprocket" like ring around the wheel near these sensors do in relation to the ABS??
Sorry but I am trying to get my head around the operational working of the ABS so if someone can stop laughing and explain it in simple terms or point me to a helpful website that would be bloody fantastic.
Many thanks and Cheers
Grant
_________________
Cheers Grant
1994 K1100RS
1981 R100RS
1978 R100RS
1928 Chevrolet tourer
www.montythe1928chevrolet.blogspot.com.au |
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drikko
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Posts: 1966
Location: Brisbane, OZ
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:01 am Post subject: |
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So the little spacers go either above or below the sensors to adjust the clearance from the toothed abs wheel. The clearance should be on a sticker near the sensor, or I can go and find the manual in the shed and see what it is if it helps.
_________________
K1100RS '97
Laverda RGS 1000 '84
Jim Young Trailer Sailer 5.7M WB
DISCLAIMER:- Anything I say may have been when I was drunk so please don't take it personally.
'Bigamy is having one wife/husband too many. Monogamy is the same.'
Oscar Wilde |
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grant93
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 238
Location: Victoria - Australia
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:30 am Post subject: |
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Drikko,
Righto mate we're off and running then, thanks for the super quick reply, yes I do have a decal down near the sensors, I will take a closer look in the morning, I thought they musta been some sort of spacer, just mak'in sure.
About the manual, yeah dust it off and then post it down here over the boarder and then over the next boarder, I could make good use of that over the next month.... don't have a spare to ya?? Have cash or will swap ya for a well used yet rather complete Yamaha IT 175H manual, just kidd'in!
Back to the toothed ABS wheel, how does this work in relation to the sensor?
Thanks for your help
Cheers Grant
_________________
Cheers Grant
1994 K1100RS
1981 R100RS
1978 R100RS
1928 Chevrolet tourer
www.montythe1928chevrolet.blogspot.com.au |
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drikko
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Posts: 1966
Location: Brisbane, OZ
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:47 am Post subject: |
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So the sensor is a simple coil pickup, as the teeth of the ABS wheel go past it changes the magnetic field enough to generate a small pulse which gets amplified in the ABS control unit. Simple huh!
This is why you can test the sensor with a multimeter to see if it's broken, ie it will measure a small number of ohms, can't remember what it should be but it won't be zero or infinity. If the pickup is too far away from the ABS wheel the signal isn't big enough for the ABS unit to see.
_________________
K1100RS '97
Laverda RGS 1000 '84
Jim Young Trailer Sailer 5.7M WB
DISCLAIMER:- Anything I say may have been when I was drunk so please don't take it personally.
'Bigamy is having one wife/husband too many. Monogamy is the same.'
Oscar Wilde |
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grant93
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 238
Location: Victoria - Australia
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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Drikko,
Love it explanation, nice and simple, everything about the toothed wheel just fell into place.
Will keep you posted over the weekend progress and enjoy Easter!! - chocolates that is.
_________________
Cheers Grant
1994 K1100RS
1981 R100RS
1978 R100RS
1928 Chevrolet tourer
www.montythe1928chevrolet.blogspot.com.au |
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Niemand
Mad Brick Rider
Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 108
Location: NC, USA
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:35 pm Post subject: Re: ABS Help Please |
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| grant93 wrote: |
Is there any special way that these need to go back in?
Do I need to use them at all?
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No. They are simply shims to get the desired clearance for the sensor. If they were taken off of a properly functioning ABS setup, then you would likely need them to get back to proper clearances, but that would be assuming it was set properly to begin with. Just keep extras around for future shimming if needed.
| grant93 wrote: |
As I do not have a manual and my bike is a 10th month 1993, is my bike ABS 1 or ABS 2?
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I could be mistaken, but I think all the '93 models had ABS 1. (My '94 has ABS2 built in 11/93) Easy way to tell would be to look for the cylinders near the footpegs labeled ABS. They are only found on ABS1 bikes.
A link to a PDF of the shop manual can be found here:
http://www.k11og.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4715
| grant93 wrote: |
Now for the dumb question.. what actually does the "sprocket" like ring around the wheel near these sensors do in relation to the ABS??
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My quite possibly flawed thinking is the ridges on the ring activate an electromagnet of some sort in the sensors allowing the ABS brain to determine wheel speed. Hence the tolerance restrictions requiring the shims to get accurate readings.
Welcome to the site, Grant.
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Niemand
1994 K1100RS
2023 DR650SE |
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grant93
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 238
Location: Victoria - Australia
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:50 pm Post subject: |
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Gidday,
Once again, thanks a lot for the reply, the info and making things a little clearer.
_________________
Cheers Grant
1994 K1100RS
1981 R100RS
1978 R100RS
1928 Chevrolet tourer
www.montythe1928chevrolet.blogspot.com.au |
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drikko
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Posts: 1966
Location: Brisbane, OZ
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| Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:21 pm Post subject: |
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Hey Grant, the picture in your sig looks like Hugh Laurie playing Lieutenant George in the last series of Blackadder 
_________________
K1100RS '97
Laverda RGS 1000 '84
Jim Young Trailer Sailer 5.7M WB
DISCLAIMER:- Anything I say may have been when I was drunk so please don't take it personally.
'Bigamy is having one wife/husband too many. Monogamy is the same.'
Oscar Wilde |
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grant93
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 238
Location: Victoria - Australia
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 2:57 am Post subject: |
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Gidday Folks,
Drikko - Love a good blackadder to btw
Today I relocated the front and rear ABS sensors to their correct ends of the bike, why you ask? well as I said earlier when I collected the bike the speedo sensors and ABS sensors were unhooked and now I have positions the shims to give the proper clearances with the correct cable at the front and back
Questions
1 - Does my bike which was built 10th month 1993 have ABS 1 or 2
2 - What does the ABS switch on the dash do? does it turn off ABS at anytime when riding if you push it??
3 - What is the correct flashing ABS light procedure when starting the bike?
4 - What is the correct route for the front ABS sensor wire? up the folk leg? or is there another way? tape and or cable tires?
Any info forwarded would be great so that next I can get started on the speedo housing issue...
Enjoy Easter and thanks heaps
_________________
Cheers Grant
1994 K1100RS
1981 R100RS
1978 R100RS
1928 Chevrolet tourer
www.montythe1928chevrolet.blogspot.com.au |
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drikko
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Posts: 1966
Location: Brisbane, OZ
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:17 am Post subject: |
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1. If there is a big thing near the rear footpegs with ABS written on it in big letters then it's ABS1. ABS2 has a dual actuator thing near the motronics under the front of the seat where the front and rear brake lines come and go to and from. I'd find a picture but it's beer o'clock....
2. NO! But it does allow you to switch the ABS off at start up. I've never done it so am not sure of the sequence.
3. On ABS2 the 2 lights flash in sequence (ie 1 then 2 then 1 then 2 etc) until you move off when they should both go out. The ABS brain has 3 processors in it, processors 1 and 2 are monitoring both sensors and making decisions about when to relieve brake pressure to stop lockup. Processor 3 does the same as well as checks processor 1 and 2 are saying exactly the same thing, if they don't then the ABS doesn't activate and the lights stay flashing so you know ABS isn't working.
4. Can't help you with 4 as my K is at a mates place about 50ks away and it may be the wrong ABS anyway.
_________________
K1100RS '97
Laverda RGS 1000 '84
Jim Young Trailer Sailer 5.7M WB
DISCLAIMER:- Anything I say may have been when I was drunk so please don't take it personally.
'Bigamy is having one wife/husband too many. Monogamy is the same.'
Oscar Wilde |
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drikko
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Posts: 1966
Location: Brisbane, OZ
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:28 am Post subject: |
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OK so here's an ABS1 modulator. If you can see 2 of these on yer bike then it's ABS1.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-K1100LT-K1100-1100-ABS-BRAKE-PRESSURE-MODULATOR-/130400728750
_________________
K1100RS '97
Laverda RGS 1000 '84
Jim Young Trailer Sailer 5.7M WB
DISCLAIMER:- Anything I say may have been when I was drunk so please don't take it personally.
'Bigamy is having one wife/husband too many. Monogamy is the same.'
Oscar Wilde |
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grant93
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 238
Location: Victoria - Australia
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:00 am Post subject: |
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Gidday folks,
No big thing near the rear pedals with ABS written on it anywhere that i can see.
But standing on the left side of my bike, below the seat is a silver metal cover with "FAG" stamped into it? Also this is something that my teenage son spotted first thing and laughed when i showed him my bike for the first time.. "Dad, ya bike has fag on it"..
Is this the ABS 2 unit, sort of left of the battery under the seat.
_________________
Cheers Grant
1994 K1100RS
1981 R100RS
1978 R100RS
1928 Chevrolet tourer
www.montythe1928chevrolet.blogspot.com.au |
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Scott_Anderson
Site Admin
Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 3122
Location: Central Iowa, USA
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 7:03 am Post subject: |
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| grant93 wrote: | Gidday folks,
No big thing near the rear pedals with ABS written on it anywhere that i can see.
But standing on the left side of my bike, below the seat is a silver metal cover with "FAG" stamped into it? Also this is something that my teenage son spotted first thing and laughed when i showed him my bike for the first time.. "Dad, ya bike has fag on it"..
Is this the ABS 2 unit, sort of left of the battery under the seat. |
Yep, that's ABS2.
The routing of the front sensor wire is basically up the back side of the fork leg to the fork bridge, then follow the brake pipe to the harness connection under the fuel tank.
On engine STARTUP, before you roll away, the abs lights should both flash at the same time(together). When you then roll off you should hear the pressure modulator cycle(unit under the seat), and the lights should then turn off.
Don't be surprised or scared of when you are out riding and take off from a stop, that you may hear the ABS unit cycle again. Mine does it from time to time when out on a ride. No consistent pattern or reason that I know of.
On engine STARTUP, if the the lights flash back and forth then you have a ABS fault, have the code read for absolute answer, but the most common reason for this is a low battery at start-up. ABS2 loves a good strong battery. If these lights are flashing back and forth the only way to stop the flashing is to press that ABS switch on the dash pad. The problem is that this doesn't solve the problem, only stops the flashing lights for about 10 minutes or so then they start flashing again.
For me if I have the alternating ABS lights, I'll just let the bike warm up a bit to charge the battery and then just restart. 99% of the time it will be fine on the 2nd start.
_________________
Ride safe.
1995 K1100LT 0302044
2017 FLHTK Ultra Limited
Garmin StreetPilot 2820
Garmin Zumo 550
Garmin Zumo XT
"One who does not ask questions is ashamed to learn" Danish proverb
1997 K1100LT 0302488(R.I.P.)
1997 R1100RT ZC62149(sold) |
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drikko
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Posts: 1966
Location: Brisbane, OZ
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 7:56 am Post subject: |
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| Scott_Anderson wrote: |
On engine STARTUP, before you roll away, the abs lights should both flash at the same time(together).........
On engine STARTUP, if the the lights flash back and forth then you have a ABS fault, . |
There you go, got it the wrong way around, sorry! As I said the bikes not here to go check.....
_________________
K1100RS '97
Laverda RGS 1000 '84
Jim Young Trailer Sailer 5.7M WB
DISCLAIMER:- Anything I say may have been when I was drunk so please don't take it personally.
'Bigamy is having one wife/husband too many. Monogamy is the same.'
Oscar Wilde |
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grant93
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 238
Location: Victoria - Australia
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| Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="drikko"] | Scott_Anderson wrote: |
On engine STARTUP, before you roll away, the abs lights should both flash at the same time(together).........
On engine STARTUP, if the the lights flash back and forth then you have a ABS fault, . |
Gidday Folks,
ABS 2 it is then, thanks for the explainations, you have been a great help.
So it looks like I have a fault as on start up it is doing as written above.
Must read up and try a few things about this ABS.
Cheers
_________________
Cheers Grant
1994 K1100RS
1981 R100RS
1978 R100RS
1928 Chevrolet tourer
www.montythe1928chevrolet.blogspot.com.au |
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grant93
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 238
Location: Victoria - Australia
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| Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:02 pm Post subject: |
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Gidday Folks,
So I found on one of the links that i can reset my ABS by using a wire connected to the middle pin of the plug and the earthing it onto a bolt.
Count to 8 while holding the switch and BINGO!! its all fixed....
Sadly this was not the case for me today, lights still flashing alternatively when key turned on.
Battery is now on the charger for the afternoon..
Cheers
Grant
_________________
Cheers Grant
1994 K1100RS
1981 R100RS
1978 R100RS
1928 Chevrolet tourer
www.montythe1928chevrolet.blogspot.com.au |
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Number 6
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 05 Feb 2011
Posts: 481
Location: Paris area, France
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| Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:22 am Post subject: |
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Start by the basics: read the error code.
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I am not a number, I am a free man.
94 K1100LT |
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grant93
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 238
Location: Victoria - Australia
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| Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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Gidday Folks,
I tried the "read the code" trick by inserting a wire into the middle socket of the plug as it was written about.
All i got out of it was now is non working headlight on either high or low beam and my high beam light on the dash now stays on all the time...
You could say I am pulling my hair out a little
Cheers Grant
_________________
Cheers Grant
1994 K1100RS
1981 R100RS
1978 R100RS
1928 Chevrolet tourer
www.montythe1928chevrolet.blogspot.com.au |
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Number 6
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 05 Feb 2011
Posts: 481
Location: Paris area, France
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| Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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To read the code you need either a 12V LED or an analog voltmeter between the middle pin and ground.
_________________
I am not a number, I am a free man.
94 K1100LT |
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grant93
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 23 Mar 2013
Posts: 238
Location: Victoria - Australia
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| Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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Gidday,
I have ABS 2 and I thought you could count the temp light flashes? i read this somewhere on one of the links, or I may be wrong.
Cheers
Grant
_________________
Cheers Grant
1994 K1100RS
1981 R100RS
1978 R100RS
1928 Chevrolet tourer
www.montythe1928chevrolet.blogspot.com.au |
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