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Moondog
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 09 Oct 2004
Posts: 670
Location: Richmond Hill, Georgia
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 Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 7:53 pm Post subject: Transmission on the bench - 1996 K1100RS |
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For anyone who has had the trany out of a K-bike.
I have mine out on my bench to tighten the shift lever set screw. Now I am ready to put it back together so I decide to make sure it is shifting through all five gears and hitting neutral.
Well it doesn't. I am not sure what gears I am hitting. The shift shaft (the forks ride in this and move the gears up and down) was out shortly after I opened the transmission up and then set it back in. I don't think it can be indexed wrong but I am not sure about the forks.
A difficult situation to describe so anyone who has had the trany out and gone into the gear box might be able to answer. Will I get all gears on the bench or do I need pressures and rotational forces to get all five gears?
I dread the thought of putting it back on the bike and have it not working correctly  |
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SugarHillCTD
Site Admin
Joined: 10 Oct 2007
Posts: 4238
Location: Now in Eastern Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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Paging Shoganai to the white courtesy phone.
Help needed on aisle 5.......
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John & Cathy
'92 K100RS4V Pearl White SOLD
'04 K1200GT
IBA Several-SS1k, BBG, 50CC NYC to S.F. |
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drikko
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Posts: 1966
Location: Brisbane, OZ
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| Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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You at least need to turn the output shaft or at least try to to get all the gears in a sequential gearbox. They won't change on their own. Can you pull the clutch in somehow and tie it off or clamp it then you can turn the output shaft while clunking up and down to check which gears you are getting.
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K1100RS '97
Laverda RGS 1000 '84
Jim Young Trailer Sailer 5.7M WB
DISCLAIMER:- Anything I say may have been when I was drunk so please don't take it personally.
'Bigamy is having one wife/husband too many. Monogamy is the same.'
Oscar Wilde |
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SugarHillCTD
Site Admin
Joined: 10 Oct 2007
Posts: 4238
Location: Now in Eastern Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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drikko,
From what I understand, Moondog's trans is still on his bench and not back in the bike.
Correct MD?
_________________
John & Cathy
'92 K100RS4V Pearl White SOLD
'04 K1200GT
IBA Several-SS1k, BBG, 50CC NYC to S.F. |
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Moondog
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 09 Oct 2004
Posts: 670
Location: Richmond Hill, Georgia
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| Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 9:18 pm Post subject: |
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Correct SugarHill,
It's sitting on my toolbox with gearbox cover off so there is a slight bit of lateral movement of the the shift shaft and drive shaft. My thinking is that (and a friend's) is that rotational movement is required. The gears are vertical now not horizontal like they would be installed on the bike. I guess I need a picture. Be right back. |
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Moondog
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 09 Oct 2004
Posts: 670
Location: Richmond Hill, Georgia
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| Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 9:48 pm Post subject: |
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My nude transmission
BTW, 108K on my bike and all drive shafts look beautiful |
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drikko
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 20 Nov 2009
Posts: 1966
Location: Brisbane, OZ
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| Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 11:00 pm Post subject: |
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| SugarHillCTD wrote: | drikko,
From what I understand, Moondog's trans is still on his bench and not back in the bike.
Correct MD? |
Ah I get it, I was thinking you had the whole motor and transmission out, blonde moment. You'd probably need to put the cover plate back on temporarily to hold all the bearings in place etc and then you can turn the output or input shaft and see which gears are working.
But then I've never had the gearbox out so I'm not too sure and should probably just STFU!
_________________
K1100RS '97
Laverda RGS 1000 '84
Jim Young Trailer Sailer 5.7M WB
DISCLAIMER:- Anything I say may have been when I was drunk so please don't take it personally.
'Bigamy is having one wife/husband too many. Monogamy is the same.'
Oscar Wilde |
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Moondog
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 09 Oct 2004
Posts: 670
Location: Richmond Hill, Georgia
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| Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:21 am Post subject: |
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| drikko wrote: | | SugarHillCTD wrote: | drikko,
From what I understand, Moondog's trans is still on his bench and not back in the bike.
Correct MD? |
Ah I get it, I was thinking you had the whole motor and transmission out, blonde moment. You'd probably need to put the cover plate back on temporarily to hold all the bearings in place etc and then you can turn the output or input shaft and see which gears are working.
But then I've never had the gearbox out so I'm not too sure and should probably just STFU!
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I tried that also and it acted in the same way. I had it apart last summer for the same issue but I can't remember if I was able to run through the gears or not. |
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Scott_Anderson
Site Admin
Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 3122
Location: Central Iowa, USA
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| Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 8:25 am Post subject: |
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I would think that if you have the cover on and the trans laying in the normal operating position, you should be able to run thru the gears while turning the shafts for each gear.
Just because you aren't turning them at 1000+ rpm, it shouldn't keep you from being able to shift the gears.
I'm thinking that when I had my trans out a couple of years ago that I was able to run thru the gears with it laying on the table.
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Ride safe.
1995 K1100LT 0302044
2017 FLHTK Ultra Limited
Garmin StreetPilot 2820
Garmin Zumo 550
Garmin Zumo XT
"One who does not ask questions is ashamed to learn" Danish proverb
1997 K1100LT 0302488(R.I.P.)
1997 R1100RT ZC62149(sold) |
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Rafal
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 05 Jan 2009
Posts: 257
Location: Wroclaw, Poland
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| Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Scott_Anderson wrote: |
I'm thinking that when I had my trans out a couple of years ago that I was able to run thru the gears with it laying on the table. |
+1 - exactly the same experience.
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Rafal
K1100RS is a real beast (in Marrakesh Red)
K75S is a real beauty - she has gone  , but not to far  .
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Moondog
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 09 Oct 2004
Posts: 670
Location: Richmond Hill, Georgia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 7:24 am Post subject: |
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So it sounds like I may have my shift forks indexed wrong or I need to put the cover on and try again. Damn if I am going to put it back on and not be able to shift it    |
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sccommuter
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 25 Oct 2011
Posts: 155
Location: Metromess, Tx
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| Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 10:52 am Post subject: |
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Never been inside the gearbox, but I replaced my transmission last year. I was able to go thru the gears with the tranny off the bike while rotating the shaft.
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1995 K1100 LT
Illegitimi non Carborundum |
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Moondog
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 09 Oct 2004
Posts: 670
Location: Richmond Hill, Georgia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 11:25 am Post subject: |
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| sccommuter wrote: | | Never been inside the gearbox, but I replaced my transmission last year. I was able to go thru the gears with the tranny off the bike while rotating the shaft. |
Well one DUH! for me!
Never gave it a thought to turn gears while shifting. DUH!
And have friend coming over this afternoon with extra pair of hands to do this. Can't shift, turn gears and hold it still. HMMM maybe I did do this right.... |
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sccommuter
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 25 Oct 2011
Posts: 155
Location: Metromess, Tx
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| Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 11:51 am Post subject: |
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I found this link helpful in understanding what's going on in the gearbox. A bit simplified, but that works for me. Good luck!
http://www.gadgetjq.com/transmission.htm
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1995 K1100 LT
Illegitimi non Carborundum |
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Moondog
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 09 Oct 2004
Posts: 670
Location: Richmond Hill, Georgia
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| Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 6:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Well poop, still can't get all gears. Back to the drawing board. |
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Shoganai
Biscuit Fluffer
Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 2234
Location: Culpeper,VA
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| Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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Moondog, I agree with what was said.
1. should be able the move thru all the gears
2. the cover should be on to do this.
3. it should be in it's natural horizonal orientataion to do this.
4. gental rotation of the output shaft will confirm placement/engagement
Are you sure you did lose any of those damn TINY detent ball bearings...
DAMHIK 
_________________
1993 K1100RS aka The Shop Whore
1994 K1100RS aka Blue Streak
The long road is a rainbow and the pot of gold lies there.
So slip the chain and I'm off again,
You'll find me everywhere. I'm a Rover. - JT
Nana korobi ya oki |
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Shoganai
Biscuit Fluffer
Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 2234
Location: Culpeper,VA
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| Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 9:48 pm Post subject: |
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I'm in the middle of a shit load of things in the garage tonight, but I'll check back later.
Put this site in favorites 
http://www.largiader.com/
_________________
1993 K1100RS aka The Shop Whore
1994 K1100RS aka Blue Streak
The long road is a rainbow and the pot of gold lies there.
So slip the chain and I'm off again,
You'll find me everywhere. I'm a Rover. - JT
Nana korobi ya oki |
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Moondog
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 09 Oct 2004
Posts: 670
Location: Richmond Hill, Georgia
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| Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2013 9:05 am Post subject: |
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| Shoganai wrote: | Moondog, I agree with what was said.
1. should be able the move thru all the gears
2. the cover should be on to do this.
3. it should be in it's natural horizontal orientation to do this.
4. gentile rotation of the output shaft will confirm placement/engagement
Are you sure you did lose any of those damn TINY detent ball bearings...
DAMHIK |
OK went that far and still jams up after two or three gears (Which gears, I'm not sure).
Cover was on, was horizontal and friend was turning output shaft.
Then I hung it in position hooked up the clutch cable and was able to all get all five but with a lot of jiggling of the clutch and foot lever and with a lot of force. It was not smooth by any stretch.
I am just wondering if somehow the shift shaft got out of sync with the shift folk (which BTW, I have all those damn pain in the ass, rotten little bearing that ride in the shift shaft and didn't lose the ball) |
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Shoganai
Biscuit Fluffer
Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 2234
Location: Culpeper,VA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2013 11:21 am Post subject: |
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What you are describing seems to be the classic "rounded input shaft" effect.
(keep in mind I am no expert)
These pics shows the 'lipping' and 'gauling' about 2/3's from the end of the shaft.
This shaft has none of that.
Sadly there is nothing to do about it but 1.) Ride it and learn how to pre-load the shifter before pulling in the clutch or 2.) replace the input shaft.
| Moondog wrote: | | ... but with a lot of jiggling of the clutch and foot lever and with a lot of force. It was not smooth by any stretch. |
_________________
1993 K1100RS aka The Shop Whore
1994 K1100RS aka Blue Streak
The long road is a rainbow and the pot of gold lies there.
So slip the chain and I'm off again,
You'll find me everywhere. I'm a Rover. - JT
Nana korobi ya oki |
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Moondog
Flying Brick Rider
Joined: 09 Oct 2004
Posts: 670
Location: Richmond Hill, Georgia
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| Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2013 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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Nope not in this case. I have looked at all
splines and they look good. I have trany
out of bike and gearbox open. I just have
binding somewhere. |
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