K11 Owners Group

Stoked Steve · Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:29 pm Post subject: Speed Bleeders

I'm in the process of doing a rebuild kit on my front M/C. I'm also cleaning the rear caliper and changing all the brake fluid (have to).

I've ordered some speed bleeders for the front calipers to simplify the bleeding process and a thought crossed my brain, why not put bleeders on the ABS pumps and the rear caliper? Then I can quickly and fully bleed the brakes at all points. They're only $7 a pop ($15 for stainless).

They all look the same (the bleeders), is there any reason you couldn't put them on all six bleed points?
_________________
Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
93 K1100RS Mystic Red SOLD
12 Suzuki DL650A VStrom

Mystic Red · Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:55 pm Post subject:

Ya mean like I did! Very Happy

Works great although when I bought them, no metric, so I always got to remind myself that a 3/8 wrench fits them.

Scott_Anderson · Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 6:24 pm Post subject:

Stoked Steve · Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 6:43 pm Post subject:

Yup, your right 5, not 6. Was thinking 3 ABS pumps, not!
_________________
Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
93 K1100RS Mystic Red SOLD
12 Suzuki DL650A VStrom

Stoked Steve · Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 6:57 pm Post subject:

Hmm, checking the Speed Bleeders website, they show the same bleeder for the front and rear calipers, but a "--" for the ABS units?

Are they a different, odd size that they don't make? Or is there some reason why the check valve would cause issues with the ABS.

Inquiring minds want to know! (I've sent them an email asking about this.)
_________________
Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
93 K1100RS Mystic Red SOLD
12 Suzuki DL650A VStrom

Saltcreek · Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 7:11 pm Post subject:

What's the process then, if you want to change out the fluid? Can you drive out the old fluid with the new?
_________________
Jim

1994 K1100LT Mystic Red, bfd, 37000 miles, sold Sad

2009 Wilderness Systems Zephyr 155 ST
2002 Litespeed titanium

Stoked Steve · Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 7:18 pm Post subject:

I believe you can, just keep adding fluid as the old leaves so that the M/C doesn't suck in any air.

http://speedbleeder.zoovy.com/

No affiliation or connection to this company, yada, yada.
_________________
Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
93 K1100RS Mystic Red SOLD
12 Suzuki DL650A VStrom

Scott_Anderson · Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 7:58 pm Post subject:

You can change the fluid either way.
I've done both. refill as you pump the old out, or suck all the old out and then refill with new.

When I have empied the system, like when I replaced the brake lines, I vacc'd/bled to the abs pump first then went to the brake calipers.

If the brake fluid is real old, like more than a couple of years, I'd recomend draining and refilling. Less waste mixing the old fluid with the new, and more likely to get more of the old out of the system.

I don't have speed bleeders, but I haven't had any problems with the regular bleed valves.
_________________
Ride safe.

1995 K1100LT 0302044
2017 FLHTK Ultra Limited
Garmin StreetPilot 2820
Garmin Zumo 550
Garmin Zumo XT
"One who does not ask questions is ashamed to learn" Danish proverb
1997 K1100LT 0302488(R.I.P.)
1997 R1100RT ZC62149(sold)

Saltcreek · Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2009 7:22 am Post subject:

Stoked Steve · Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:46 pm Post subject:

Well, I got my speed bleeders today and spent most of the evening completing the master cylinder rebuild and installing the bleeders and re-filling and bleeding the whole brake system, front and rear.

All in all it was easier and worked out better than I thought, especially after reading the many posts about bleeding/priming issues.

I had the front master cylinder rebuilt when I bought the bike 5 years ago by the local BMW dealer. Ever since then, the rubber boot that seals the cylinder was loose and sloppy and it started weeping again within months. When I got the new rebuild kit (Magura from Beemer Boneyard, $42.00! for a simple piston and a new rubber boot) I noticed how much smaller the new boot was, I thought maybe it was the wrong part. Turns out it actually fits tight like it should! Which made me mad that dealer must have re-used the old boot which was wanged out and never really stayed on right, which likely lead to crud getting into the cylinder, resulting in the need for another rebuild!

The rest of the rebuild went smoothly, I took my time and cleaned everything as much as possible, there was a bunch of crud, but the cylinder walls were smooth and pit free, I still cleaned it out with 000 steel wool and starter fluid until it was smooth as a babies butt. Lightly greased the piston cups and the pivot pin and reassembled.

I want to point out what I believe is a serious misprint in the manual about re-installing everything. It says to coat the stop screw with loctite, re-install until there is no play in the hand lever and then tighten one half turn more. I believe they meant this to be the pivot or hinge pin bolt, not the piston stop screw. The piston stop screw, which keeps the piston from ejecting, doesn't have anything to do with the lever free play, but the pivot/hinge pin does affect the lever free play. The stop pin simply restricts the movement of the piston in and out and I think should be just loctited and tightend to torque (or just tight). I think if you tried to turn it a full half turn after it seats, you could strip it out!

Then I installed the speed bleeders and refilled the M/C with fluid and then very gently squeezed the lever about a hundred times until fluid came out of the ABS bleeder and then the caliper bleeds and kept bleeding until no more bubbles came out. The lever travel is super smooth now and it returns properly again, cutting off the brake light like it should. It was sticking before and not quite cutting the light off. I haven't been able to road test the brakes yet as I'm waiting for my gas tank re-lining to cure first, they might need another round of bleeding to get the last bit of air out, but the brakes feel nice and tight in the shop.

The speed bleeders work as advertised and were easy to install, just like replacing the original bleeders. They were a bit stiff to screw in as they have a reusable loctite type coating on the threads. Also they don’t screw all the way down before they seat, there is still about a millimeter of thread showing when they seat, don't over tighten!

For $7 a piece they are a great way to make it easier to bleed the system and I'd recommend them.

I did pull the ABS bleeders out and see if I could use speed bleeders there as well, but they seem to have a different stem length and were not quite the same as the caliper bleeders, maybe they just don't make speed bleeders for those(?)

I would also add that I have never done any major work on a bikes brakes and it was much easier than I feared, it's about a 4 on the difficulty scale of 1 to 10. You just have to take your time and cover up everything really well, clean everything well and be careful with the fluid around the paint. I think I did a better and more thorough job than my local shop did.
_________________
Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
93 K1100RS Mystic Red SOLD
12 Suzuki DL650A VStrom

Jim · Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 12:36 am Post subject: brake bleed

Good job, Steve. If you did anything wrong with those little screws on the MC, you'll find out when the front brake self applies...

DAMHIK...
_________________
Jim
1997 K1100LTSE 94,000 - still has gremlins!
1995 R100RT Classic 16,650 crashed - repaired!
1992 K75RTP 46,000

"We shall not all die, but we shall all be changed."

Stoked Steve · Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 8:55 am Post subject:

I won't ask how you know, but I am curiuos what happened? Did the cylinder stop screw back out enough to allow the piston the bind up on it?

I want to be sure I don't have the same experience.
_________________
Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
93 K1100RS Mystic Red SOLD
12 Suzuki DL650A VStrom

Mystic Red · Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 9:14 am Post subject:

Steve, I've got the speed bleeders on my modulator. I'm pretty sure it's the same part.
_________________
Scott Hespelt, '94 K11LT
K11 OG #466

Scott_Anderson · Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 1:28 pm Post subject:

Scott, with Steve's bike being a 93RS and yours a 94LT I'd bet that his is abs I while yours is abs II. Totally different. So it's possible for his bleeders to be different as well.
_________________
Ride safe.

1995 K1100LT 0302044
2017 FLHTK Ultra Limited
Garmin StreetPilot 2820
Garmin Zumo 550
Garmin Zumo XT
"One who does not ask questions is ashamed to learn" Danish proverb
1997 K1100LT 0302488(R.I.P.)
1997 R1100RT ZC62149(sold)

Stoked Steve · Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 2:36 pm Post subject:

Correct Scott A, I have ABS 1 with two modulators, I pulled one of the bleeders out and compared the two side by side, they were very similiar, but the stock ABS bleeder looked a bit longer from the threads down and had a slightly different shape to it.

They might work, but I didn't want to bung anything up forcing something in there that wasn't exactly the same.

Maybe a more adventurous type would like to try? I now have two extra speed bleeders...
_________________
Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
93 K1100RS Mystic Red SOLD
12 Suzuki DL650A VStrom

Jim · Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 5:02 pm Post subject: brake bleed

jpberens1994K1100RS · Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2009 7:22 pm Post subject: MC rebuild

&#@*%#*%!* Evil or Very Mad

I bought a rebuild kit from Beemer Boneyard and I DID NOT get a new rubber boot. Evil or Very Mad

The design is flawed IMHO. The plastic cover froms a well that traps water
too close to the front of the MC. I made drain holes in the lowest corner so this cannot happen.

I had to use my old boot as I did not get one, but I cleaned everything up like new, and then used " Permatex" liquid gasket to seal the old boot to the front of the MC and hold it tight in it's grooves. The fit of the boot around the piston accuator rod is AOK snug, also IMHO.

Did this last year late summer, along with full bleed of the system, all is still well.
_________________
1993 K1100RS that I'd rather be riding FAST!
2014 Moto Guzzi Norge

Stoked Steve · Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:05 pm Post subject:

I did notice the kit says "now includes a new rubber boot", as if it didn't before.

Got the bike all back together this morning. resealed gas tank installed, internals re-installed, fueled up, brakes all proper, cat painted, etc., etc.

Went for the "show time" restart, here it comes, big moment....click, nothing! AGGHhhh!

Oh wait, the side stand is down, duh... ready, all set, click, nothing!!!

Ok, stay calm, thinking the worst, what did I fark up? Take a minute to think through......

D'oh! it must be in nuetral to start! Click into nuetral,,,, VROOOMMM!

All is good. Did a slow couple of miles around the neighborhood, re-bleed the brakes one more time, some air bubbles still...then Viola, tight brakes, all is well, and I set off on a 35 mile country road romp. Blew past a few squids like they were standing still, Beemer heaven!

Soon the RAM shock will arrive and a new front tire and look out Hungry Mother, here I come!

_________________
Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
93 K1100RS Mystic Red SOLD
12 Suzuki DL650A VStrom

Off the grid · Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:18 pm Post subject:

Great looking K Steve! The RS is truly the best looking of the 2.
_________________
Bane of your existence since July 2006
2007 Triumph Tiger ABS. "Sabertooth"
2009 Husqvarna TE610. "The dirty Italian mistress"

Mystic Red · Posted: Sun Apr 05, 2009 10:18 pm Post subject: