K11 Owners Group

yhog · Posted: Sun Dec 28, 2008 6:15 am Post subject: 1100LT rear shock

I plan to change rear shock of my 1100LT(1997)in new year. Now I focus couple products. I like to have a comments about EMC shock (Made in England) if anyone has experience use this shock Laughing

http://www.the-internet-pages.co.uk/england/oxfo/cycles1/vtn5.htm

And also glad to hear recommendation which shock is better Wink

chopper_harris · Posted: Sun Dec 28, 2008 6:39 am Post subject:

THere is something a little odd here - I've been in the motorcycle restoration business for over 20 years, and have never heard of these guys.

If they are new, then their product is not as widely tested as the competition.
Also, they sell Hagon shocks at a cheaper price than their own brand Confused

I'm an authorised Hagon installer, and I have never had any problems with a Hagon unit in over 10 years.

Why buy an unknown brand - Hagon has global agents and you can buy locally in Japan :

http://www.hagon-shocks.co.uk/wdasia.htm
_________________
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Kawasaki KLV1000 (2005)
K12R Sport (2007) - Wifeys

yhog · Posted: Sun Dec 28, 2008 8:30 am Post subject: How was it ?

HI chopper_harris Very Happy

Thank you for your reply.
I have never used both EMS and HAGON. I just checked EMS in web site. I have no special intention about EMS. Laughing

I like to hear how good HAGON. Especially road traceabilities and bump shock absorption.

Tim (Midland Section) · Posted: Sun Dec 28, 2008 5:48 pm Post subject:

I'll bet Beachcomber knows something about these, I'm sure he'll be along soon.
_________________
Regards Tim,

Grey haired riders don't get that way by pure luck
1996 Guzzi Cali3 LAPD
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G6HRN
#485

BobZ(IL) · Posted: Sun Dec 28, 2008 5:58 pm Post subject:

Hagons on back of my R-bike have been great performers for over 25k miles.
_________________
'93 K1100LT
'78 R100S
'05 R1200GS
BMWMOA, CRBMWOA, ABC, K11OG #997

Live well, do good work, enjoy the ride.

Beachcomber · Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2008 7:41 am Post subject:

gosh, am I that shallow Tim ??????????????????

BTW - Chopper - one thing I've learned in over 45 years of business - NEVER denigrate the opposition. Especially when [ as you've declared ] you know nothing about them? Embarassed

Remember the days when Hagon was "unknown"? Wink

Anyway, as Tim says, I HAVE been involved [ as an end user / customer ] with developing an aluminium bodied shock directly with a mainstream manufacturer, which is fully adjustable on spring platform and dampening. Additionally, it has been developed [ initially ] for the Kay series. Why? because I've got several Kays and needed an inexpensive QUALITY shock. Rather than go over all the old ground, just check out my various postings on the UK forums when the shock was being developed. Cool

The shock is RAM - it retails at £195.00 [+vat + carriage ] for Kay series, with a discount for club / forum members [ 10% ]. Options on shorter shox, competition versions, etc.,etc.

Realm Engineering Ltd. are the suppliers with Cafe-Moto as an agent for bike orientated shocks.

I have no wish to abuse the forum for unabashed advertising, so here is Realm Engineering's general website - must be OK as Hagon's is listed - www.realmengineering.com.

You will see that their core business is Replica Sports and Racing Series cars. This is where the connection with speciality shox comes in.

TJ
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Beachcomber '93 K1100RS / '93 K1100LT and several K100's

Beachcomber · Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2008 8:49 am Post subject:

Just to correct my earlier posting Embarassed

- the shock [ which I have at £195 ] is for a K100RS, the shock for the K11 series is £225 + vat and carriage. Still qualifies for a 10% discount for K11OG members.

Just noticed a slight contradiction in terms Chopper -

In 20 years you've NEVER heard of EMC, but you KNOW that they sell Hagon's cheaper than their own shox???????????????????? Rolling Eyes

Maybe as the Hagon is a STEEL bodied shock, it is less expensive to begin with? It would be like saying that ANY make is cheaper than Ohlins. Laughing

TJ
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Beachcomber '93 K1100RS / '93 K1100LT and several K100's

Tim (Midland Section) · Posted: Mon Dec 29, 2008 6:58 pm Post subject:

Beachcomber · Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2008 7:03 am Post subject:

Hi Tim

Maybe I should explain to any of our US cousins reading this about UK tongue in cheek humour? Laughing

Perhaps I should also briefly explain to anyone who doesn't have time / interest to check out what's been going on with the postings on the UK /German forums. Wink

The RAM shock development came about as I PERSONALLY wanted an inexpensive quality shock for my Kay. Admittedly, there are some special requirements of a bike shock that would make it more expensive - but there's more expensive and more expensive, if you get my drift.

I have been involved in specialty cars [ Replica, Race ] all my life, and since I "retired" have continued to carry out engineering design consultancy for selected clients, who in the main have become friends in the past 35 years of conducting business. Cool

I persuaded one such - Realm Engineering Ltd. , [who I still carry out design development for] to look into the possibility of adapting one of their Cobra Race Replica shox for my Kay, as I was somewhat alarmed at the price difference between auto and very similar bike shox.

The rest is history, and after some 6 months of liaison / development / road testing, they came up with the CM350/10 shock for my K100.

The manufacturer is a main stream speciality auto shock manufacturer who has all the necessary laboratory / workshop facilities to develop and test such a shock and has been making auto shox for a very long time.

And before ANYONE states the obvious about never having heard of them - the shox are FULLY REBUILDABLE and carry a THREE YEAR / 30K km GUARRANTEE.

I have been PM'ing with several forum members - but just to clarify - Realm have authorised me to extend a 10% discount offer to members in return for my liaison work and the help of forum members. If anyone wishes to liaise with me I can send pix for publication - I have NO idea how to do it myself! Embarassed

Coincidentally they have realised that there is a VAST market for bike shox.................................................... Expect to see more, Twisted Evil

TJ
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Beachcomber '93 K1100RS / '93 K1100LT and several K100's

AndrewD · Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 5:31 am Post subject:

Chopper's too much of a Gent to reply.........I'm not, neither do I have any link to Hagon or any other financial interests.

Beachcomber · Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 11:25 am Post subject:

AndrewD,

few raw nerves touched there eh? Wink

Without resorting to suggesting fingers your eyes or any other orifice, I would suggest that you had not read MY reply with any degree of accuracy.

I'm not very well versed in pasting quotes, and I suspect that people would get very bored with escalating a little tongue in cheek action to the fingers in eyes level you seem to prefer - I don't intend to respond in the same vein. Rolling Eyes

MY shock absorber - is in fact NOTHING to do with me on a commercial basis. I simply saw an opportunity to have what I considered an inexpensive / quality shock developed at NO cost to me, and the benefits passed on to other club members, which Realm have agreed to with a club discount. Why should be so upset at the possibility of having a quality product available to you [ and with a discount] ?

As far as the Loch Ness [ Not sure what LOCK ??? Ness is, but I think I understand what you mean ] shox pix are concerned, thanx for your kind offer but another forum member has already volunteered to post pix on my behalf. But if you just CAN'T wait, check out the various UK sites where you will see pix that have been posted for the past 12 weeks or so, also with offers of discounts to forum members in return for their input in the development. Strange you haven't seen them on the UK forums, I'm sure I've seen your userid on the UK sites?

BTW - the cost difference between Hagon and EMC wasn't the point I was making - it was the fact that Chopper "had not heard of them" but a few sentences later mentioned the price difference - suggesting he HAD heard of them. Not Jedi, but obviously Clairvoyant.

Outlets in Japan? Yes Realm already sell their C Type and D Type Jags there. Thanx for the headsup though re: the Japanese certification - I'll pass that on so he can get his Japanese agent to get on with it. Laughing

I don't expect that you will a customer for the RAM shox anytime, but if you do, you will be extended the same discount offer.
TJ
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Beachcomber '93 K1100RS / '93 K1100LT and several K100's

AndrewD · Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 12:43 pm Post subject:

No touched nerves here Razz

As far as I can see, Chopper had not seen the EMC shocks until yhog had posted the link, so I don't see what your point was/is?

I have been very interested in this shock as I have seen the information grow on this and the BM riders forum. It is in fact something one of our group has been considering. Certainly at less than £200 it is very good value for money.

As for pics, I have seen none, possibly because they are on BM riders only?

However, I am as are others a little confused.

You have stated that this was a 'Cafe-Moto' shock not a Realm in your original posting.

Beachcomber · Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 2:42 pm Post subject:

OK Andrew - logical debate, that I can respond to Laughing

Still can't do the paste things but -

Pix are on both the main UK forums, and as stated - a US forum member has agreed to post the pix I have already sent him. You say you can't access the UK forum pix - I guess you are not a member then? Rolling Eyes

To assist in dissapating your confusion.

Cafe-Moto is a company that has been set up to market a range of Cafe Racer equipment - including GRP and accesory parts. This company will eventually be the sole outlet for UK motorcycle related sales - the shock remains a RAM whether for Automotive or motorcycle use, but to avoid confusion the two marketing names were chosen. Yea, looks VERY bad. Rolling Eyes

Realm were given a basic shock to test for the basic parameters of a stock item. Far from being copied [ what's the point?] Realm took one of their existing shox that's been in use in the speciality market for a long time and using the base parameters and the requirements for the bike, came up with the developed item for the Kay.

BTW are you trying to tell me that all shox on the market are blue sky thinking?

2000 miles of road testing - pity you didn't read ALL of the posts and not just select an item that supports your point. [b]The latest posts I have made have stated the CURRENT mileages as in excess of 7,000 on two different bikes.[/b] The shox have been lab tested on relevant equipment to a point where the manufacturer is prepared to put a 3 year / 30K kms guarrantee on the product. Are you querying HIS legitimacy - especially when you have NO idea who he is?

You state you are sure about the extensive testing of these units - what can I say - at least you got that right. Laughing

Just in case that selective quote button went a little astray again - let me repeat - the shock was based on an alloy bodied RACE unit Realm have used on their Race and road cars for many years - quite a few "emergency conditions" whilst racing. Ditto with fatique testing, etc.,etc. NOT STOLEN a design and had it made from a totally different material.

One test bike is my K100RS, which when tested was completely stock apart from having the panniers removed. My friend's bike is a fully dressed K100LT - completely standard BTW.
Again, had you not hit the "selective quote" button - you would have read[ or at least reported ] that my friend took a trip to Wales fully loaded with his camping gear and a passenger. But that doesn't support your point quite so well does it?

The K1100RS shock was tested before the bike was stripped down - completely stock, but without panniers.

You assert that I have STOLEN a design AndrewD - do you want to repeat that allegation? Or suggest which design I have [ by your allegation ] stolen? Cool

As to the apparant high cost of bike shox, I have stated that there are special requirements that make a bike shock more expensive - my query is by how much more? Indeed, the RAM bike shox are more expensive than the automotive equivalent, but it's as much the numbers game at the moment as a real price difference.

As you've already mentioned Hagon - did you or Chopper go through all this before you accepted them as OK for use? Did you voice concerns about the legitimacy of their testing [ or how would you even KNOW about their testing ?]. Was this a "Blue Sky" design - something completely new and unlike anything on the market Wink

. I've got very similar Spax and Gaz [ automotive ] shox but I don't expect that one stole the other's design.

I suspect that ALL shox share similar basics, some manufacturers will have a special gizzmo here or there - but essentially all share the same design.

Ahh Ohlins - I think everyone can agree that is the pinnacle of design - yes a Piggy back remote reservoir shock is being evaluated as we speak, but then I guess you won't be looking at one of them either.
TJ
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Beachcomber '93 K1100RS / '93 K1100LT and several K100's

Jim · Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2008 11:39 pm Post subject:

OK, boys, go to your rooms ----- NOW! Seriously, if you're going to sling mud, hurl epithets, and call each other names, I respectfully request you take it off line.
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Jim
1997 K1100LTSE 94,000 - still has gremlins!
1995 R100RT Classic 16,650 crashed - repaired!
1992 K75RTP 46,000

"We shall not all die, but we shall all be changed."

littlebluesanta · Joined: 17 Jul 2007 Posts: 12 Location: berkshire UK

Hi,
I have a Hagon made 2"made shorter then the BMW one.
And it work's well.